by Dr. Radut

Q&A - Dealing With bikes at 4-way Stop with Bike Lane

Published by DamnIHateThat -

CyclistI wonder if someone could help me understand how this intersection should work:

If I wish to make a right turn, I am uncertain of who has the right-of-way if a bicycle stops at the stop sign AFTER I have stopped but both of us are waiting for our turn to proceed.  (In my mind, the bike lane should have a broken white line near the stop sign so I could pull over to the right as far as possible to ensure that a bike doesn't attempt to pass on the right.)

Thanks,
John

Published by CompetentDrivingBC - 2016/08/25 - 22:27 | Permalink

If I wish to make a right turn, I am uncertain of who has the right-of-way if a bicycle stops at the stop sign AFTER I have stopped but both of us are waiting for our turn to proceed.

The way I see it, legally speaking, nobody ever has the right-of-way in BC. However, there are many occasions when drivers (or other road users) are required to give it.

And, there's no such thing as a 4-Way Stop (or an All-Way Stop) in the BC Motor Vehicle Act, although they certainly exist at many intersections. I'm not being clever, here; the presence of a Stop sign (or two of them on opposite sides of what would be considered the 'Main Road' is an understood concept.

I don't believe that the solid white line indicating the area where the cyclists are supposed to ride necessarily denotes separate traffic lanes; so (provided there's no cyclist there when you come up to the intersection, it's entirely reasonable, and in accordance with Section 165(1) to move over close to the right curb or edge of roadway in preparation for your right turn).

Cyclists are subject to the same traffic laws as everybody else, and I'm meaning vehicles here, not pedestrians.

So, under Section 186, we realize that everybody has to stop in actuality and positioned properly.

At which point, Section 169 comes into play.

Which basically means that, at an All Way or 4-Way Stop intersection, once a driver - or cyclist - has met those preconditions, and then moves into the intersection, every other driver or cyclist there must yield right of way to them.

 

... there are several items on this website, here.

And I'm sure that Tim did some solid research within the last few months on this very subject, just can't figure out which Thread it was, yet - or what absolute conclusions were reached.

I have accumulated a ton of stuff on here over the years and I'm glad that I categorized it all. You can sift through it using the search blank at the top left of pages or by using the Content by Category link in the left column and then choosing your subject area out of the "cloud." In this case, it would by Cycling.

The size of the category type face is an indication of it's popularity.

 

I wrote about that in Do Bike Lanes Confuse Drivers? back in May of last year.

CompetentDrivingBC's thought about crossing the solid line in order to turn right is dealt with there too.

As there is a lane there, cyclists may pass on the right when using it. This does complicate matters for the driver as they must shoulder check and account for both pedestrians and cyclists before they turn right after stopping.

If the cyclist is there first, they would proceed first. If you are there first, you would proceed first.

BC is supposed to be in the process of making changes to the Motor Vehicle Act to better include cyclists and their lanes in modern times according to a lawyer I have traded e-mails with. I have yet to see any public announcement or consultation on the issue, but when I do you will find out about it here.

I wrote about that in Do Bike Lanes Confuse Drivers? back in May of last year.

CompetentDrivingBC's thought about crossing the solid line in order to turn right is dealt with there too.

 Ah, so you did. Pasting this piece:

For the driver, the concept of roadway suddenly becomes very important. Roadway includes the lanes motor vehicles drive in and the area where they park at the side of the highway that is not the shoulder. So, if you approach an intersection intending to make a right turn, your pre-turn position is dependent on whether there is a curb or parking is available to the right of the bicycle lane or not. If not, you must remain to the left of the bicycle lane

 And you know what? That's just stupid and you can tell Todd Stone I said so, lol!

Moving to the right with your vehicle, in preparation for the turn, is only logical. Do you then physically block a cyclist coming up behind? Yes; and what a great idea; makes the turn easier and protects the cyclist from you. But if it's illegal then I guess we shouldn't do it, however sensible a solution.

Published by DamnIHateThat - 2016/09/07 - 11:31 | Permalink

I contacted the City of Kamloops and got a very nice reply.  They believe that the white line which separates the bike lane from the car lane should in fact be a dashed white line as it nears the intersection.  They will be repainting it accordingly in the spring.

I think this will be much safer all around.

Cycling
Lanes
Turns